Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

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Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Leo User
howdy folks,

I know your still in 2.2, but it looks like your
future is looming closer.  Im getting a nice little
body of work built up and am not too keen on being
selfish about it.  If your going to be interested in
any goodies, let me know.

thanks!
leouser

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

fwierzbicki@gmail.com
On 4/26/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> howdy folks,
>
> I know your still in 2.2, but it looks like your
> future is looming closer.  Im getting a nice little
> body of work built up and am not too keen on being
> selfish about it.  If your going to be interested in
> any goodies, let me know.
Glad to here that you don't feel selfish about your stuff :)

Charlie has applied some of your patches already -- and I do hope that
we can eventually use more of your code.  I think the biggest barrier
for the next iteration is going to be the JDK version -- I know you
have a fair amount of JDK 1.6isms in your code, and I don't think we
are going to go above JDK 1.5 in the next release.  But the next next
release will probably be a good time for such things, and hopefully
that will come much much much sooner than the current rev took.

Speaking of current and eventual code contributions, would you mind
signing a PSF form for contributors?  The psf needs one of these for
any but the smallest contributions.

(copied from an AMK post):

Please print out a copy of
<http://www.python.org/psf/contrib/contrib-form-jython/>, sign
it, and mail it to the address on the form.  Note that you have only
two choices for the 'initial license' you fill in; see
<http://www.python.org/psf/contrib/> for details.

Regards,

-Frank

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Leo User
--- Frank Wierzbicki <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 4/26/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > howdy folks,
> >
> > I know your still in 2.2, but it looks like your
> > future is looming closer.  Im getting a nice
> little
> > body of work built up and am not too keen on being
> > selfish about it.  If your going to be interested
> in
> > any goodies, let me know.
> Glad to here that you don't feel selfish about your
> stuff :)
>
> Charlie has applied some of your patches already --
> and I do hope that
> we can eventually use more of your code.  I think
> the biggest barrier
> for the next iteration is going to be the JDK
> version -- I know you
> have a fair amount of JDK 1.6isms in your code, and
> I don't think we
> are going to go above JDK 1.5 in the next release.

Yeah Im trying to keep the 6isms down, sometimes they
slip in.  
> But the next next
> release will probably be a good time for such
> things, and hopefully
> that will come much much much sooner than the
> current rev took.
>

One thing Ive discovered is that even from version to
version, new things will change.  Just today I got the
_heapqmodule implemented.  One thing it relies upon
are "attrgetter" and "itemgetter" from operator.
These both appeared in 2.4 but changed again in 2.5,
you might want to keep that in mind when your
targeting your function set.

> Speaking of current and eventual code contributions,
> would you mind
> signing a PSF form for contributors?  The psf needs
> one of these for
> any but the smallest contributions.
>
> (copied from an AMK post):
>
> Please print out a copy of
>
<http://www.python.org/psf/contrib/contrib-form-jython/>,
> sign
> it, and mail it to the address on the form.  Note
> that you have only
> two choices for the 'initial license' you fill in;
> see
> <http://www.python.org/psf/contrib/> for details.
>

Yeah, Ill see what I can do. :)
leouser


> Regards,
>
> -Frank
>



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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

fwierzbicki@gmail.com
On 4/26/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Yeah Im trying to keep the 6isms down, sometimes they
> slip in.
That's good to hear.  Perhaps we can pull in more of your stuff sooner.

> One thing Ive discovered is that even from version to
> version, new things will change.  Just today I got the
> _heapqmodule implemented.  One thing it relies upon
> are "attrgetter" and "itemgetter" from operator.
> These both appeared in 2.4 but changed again in 2.5,
> you might want to keep that in mind when your
> targeting your function set.
Okay.  We haven't yet picked a target -- but I expect it will either
be 2.4 or 2.5.  We are getting closer and closer to a final 2.2.  As
soon as that is really done, we'll need to make that decision pretty
quickly.

>
> > Speaking of current and eventual code contributions,
> > would you mind
> > signing a PSF form for contributors?
> Yeah, Ill see what I can do. :)
Great, thanks!

-Frank

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Charlie Groves
In reply to this post by Leo User
I'm definitely interested in your jythonx work, but I didn't realize
it was open as a project on java.net until now.  Would you mind giving
a quick summary of what you've done so far?

Thanks,
Charlie

On 4/26/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:

> howdy folks,
>
> I know your still in 2.2, but it looks like your
> future is looming closer.  Im getting a nice little
> body of work built up and am not too keen on being
> selfish about it.  If your going to be interested in
> any goodies, let me know.
>
> thanks!
> leouser
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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> Jython-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-dev
>

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Leo User
well, let me see here,

I believe there are implementations of all language changes from 2.3 to 2.5 on svn.  Yield as an expression is still in progress, really that's just a question of finding places where using it as an expression is going to cause problems.  For the most part classical byte code output is ok.  When its not ok is say when a new object is being constructed and you have a yield expression as one of the parameters.  Then something different has to happen.  Im planning on doing 2.6 features as soon as they are finalized by the python PEP for 2.6.  Maybe something like switch statements will show up once its put together.

There are java translations of python c modules itertools, collections, _csv, _functoolsmoudle and _heapqmodule out there.  Im currently looking into making a modern _codecsmodule, and am sketching out the bz2 module.  Each one of these seems to help out in implementing other pieces.  There wouldn't be a 2.5 heapq module out there if itertools wasn't in place.

There are numerous other little pieces out there, maybe an implementation of __missing__ for dictionary.  If its mentioned as something that has changed in a version, Im trying to get it in.

leouser





Charlie Groves <[hidden email]> wrote:
I'm definitely interested in your jythonx work, but I didn't realize
it was open as a project on java.net until now. Would you mind giving
a quick summary of what you've done so far?

Thanks,
Charlie

On 4/26/07, Leo User wrote:

> howdy folks,
>
> I know your still in 2.2, but it looks like your
> future is looming closer. Im getting a nice little
> body of work built up and am not too keen on being
> selfish about it. If your going to be interested in
> any goodies, let me know.
>
> thanks!
> leouser
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
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> Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-dev
>

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Charlie Groves
On 4/28/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I believe there are implementations of all language changes from 2.3 to 2.5
> on svn.  Yield as an expression is still in progress, really that's just a
> question of finding places where using it as an expression is going to cause
> problems.  For the most part classical byte code output is ok.  When its not
> ok is say when a new object is being constructed and you have a yield
> expression as one of the parameters.  Then something different has to
> happen.  Im planning on doing 2.6 features as soon as they are finalized by
> the python PEP for 2.6.  Maybe something like switch statements will show up
> once its put together.

This should be of interest to the summer of code crew working on
improving the compiler and getting to 2.5 language level support.
Since they're replacing the parser with ANTLR and CodeCompiler.java
with asm it won't be directly applicable, but at least the way the
newer language features hook into the runtime should be similar.

> There are java translations of python c modules itertools, collections,
> _csv, _functoolsmoudle and _heapqmodule out there.  Im currently looking
> into making a modern _codecsmodule, and am sketching out the bz2 module.
> Each one of these seems to help out in implementing other pieces.  There
> wouldn't be a 2.5 heapq module out there if itertools wasn't in place.

We've already picked up a really nice version of itertools, but
acquiring the other modules you've already ported would be great.
What do you need to modernize in _codecs?  There were big changes from
2.2 to 2.3, but I brought those over ages ago on the 2.3 branch.

Where did you end up with your optimizations to Java method invocation?

Charlie

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Tobias Ivarsson


On 4/29/07, Charlie Groves <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 4/28/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I believe there are implementations of all language changes from 2.3 to 2.5
> on svn.  Yield as an expression is still in progress, really that's just a
> question of finding places where using it as an expression is going to cause
> problems.  For the most part classical byte code output is ok.  When its not
> ok is say when a new object is being constructed and you have a yield
> expression as one of the parameters.  Then something different has to
> happen.  Im planning on doing 2.6 features as soon as they are finalized by
> the python PEP for 2.6.  Maybe something like switch statements will show up
> once its put together.

This should be of interest to the summer of code crew working on
improving the compiler and getting to 2.5 language level support.
Since they're replacing the parser with ANTLR and CodeCompiler.java
with asm it won't be directly applicable, but at least the way the
newer language features hook into the runtime should be similar.

I am part of that crew, and can nothing but agree with Charlie, there are definitely some interesting features in JythonX. I checked out the source from svn about two weeks ago, and started looking at it. I haven't had that much time though, since I am still up to my ears in my courses for this semester.
In about a week from now I will be in San Francisco for JavaOne and it would be great to meet as many of you guys as possible there to discuss various ideas. If I remember correctly you were supposed to be there Leo, weren't you? I would very much like to meet you there to get input from your experience from JythonX.

> There are java translations of python c modules itertools, collections,
> _csv, _functoolsmoudle and _heapqmodule out there.  Im currently looking
> into making a modern _codecsmodule, and am sketching out the bz2 module.
> Each one of these seems to help out in implementing other pieces.  There
> wouldn't be a 2.5 heapq module out there if itertools wasn't in place.

We've already picked up a really nice version of itertools, but
acquiring the other modules you've already ported would be great.
What do you need to modernize in _codecs?  There were big changes from
2.2 to 2.3, but I brought those over ages ago on the 2.3 branch.

Where did you end up with your optimizations to Java method invocation?

Charlie

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Leo User
Tobias Ivarsson <[hidden email]> wrote:


On 4/29/07, Charlie Groves <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 4/28/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I believe there are implementations of all language changes from 2.3 to 2.5
> on svn.  Yield as an expression is still in progress, really that's just a
> question of finding places where using it as an expression is going to cause
> problems.  For the most part classical byte code output is ok.  When its not
> ok is say when a new object is being constructed and you have a yield
> expression as one of the parameters.  Then something different has to
> happen.  Im planning on doing 2.6 features as soon as they are finalized by
> the python PEP for 2.6.  Maybe something like switch statements will show up
> once its put together.

This should be of interest to the summer of code crew working on
improving the compiler and getting to 2.5 language level support.
Since they're replacing the parser with ANTLR and CodeCompiler.java
with asm it won't be directly applicable, but at least the way the
newer language features hook into the runtime should be similar.

I am part of that crew, and can nothing but agree with Charlie, there are definitely some interesting features in JythonX. I checked out the source from svn about two weeks ago, and started looking at it. I haven't had that much time though, since I am still up to my ears in my courses for this semester.
In about a week from now I will be in San Francisco for JavaOne and it would be great to meet as many of you guys as possible there to discuss various ideas. If I remember correctly you were supposed to be there Leo, weren't you? I would very much like to meet you there to get input from your experience from JythonX.

Well, thanks for asking, I'm sure it would be interesting to talk about this stuff but I won't be there.  Best of luck on your ANTLR work and ASM work.  Im still wondering myself what could be gained by using ASM.

leouser


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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Leo User
In reply to this post by Charlie Groves
Charlie Groves <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 4/28/07, Leo User wrote:
> I believe there are implementations of all language changes from 2.3 to 2.5
> on svn. Yield as an expression is still in progress, really that's just a
> question of finding places where using it as an expression is going to cause
> problems. For the most part classical byte code output is ok. When its not
> ok is say when a new object is being constructed and you have a yield
> expression as one of the parameters. Then something different has to
> happen. Im planning on doing 2.6 features as soon as they are finalized by
> the python PEP for 2.6. Maybe something like switch statements will show up
> once its put together.

This should be of interest to the summer of code crew working on
improving the compiler and getting to 2.5 language level support.
Since they're replacing the parser with ANTLR and CodeCompiler.java
with asm it won't be directly applicable, but at least the way the
newer language features hook into the runtime should be similar.

> There are java translations of python c modules itertools, collections,
> _csv, _functoolsmoudle and _heapqmodule out there. Im currently looking
> into making a modern _codecsmodule, and am sketching out the bz2 module.
> Each one of these seems to help out in implementing other pieces. There
> wouldn't be a 2.5 heapq module out there if itertools wasn't in place.

We've already picked up a really nice version of itertools, but
acquiring the other modules you've already ported would be great.
What do you need to modernize in _codecs? There were big changes from
2.2 to 2.3, but I brought those over ages ago on the 2.3 branch.

Where did you end up with your optimizations to Java method invocation?

Charlie
codecswise I haven't made a detailed analysis of the whole thing besides that its wanting in codecs and doesn't appear geared towards the new Unicode exceptions.

Ill have to check out your itertools implementation, there was one test case I couldn't pass... maybe you folks found a fix for it. :)

leouser


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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Henrik Eriksson-2
On 4/30/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Ill have to check out your itertools implementation, there was one test case
> I couldn't pass... maybe you folks found a fix for it. :)

Note that the itertools module for jython (2.3+) only implements the
equivalent of the CPython 2.3 itertools module. I.e groupby and tee
are missing.

'Henke

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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Leo User
--- Henrik Eriksson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 4/30/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Ill have to check out your itertools
> implementation, there was one test case
> > I couldn't pass... maybe you folks found a fix for
> it. :)
>
> Note that the itertools module for jython (2.3+)
> only implements the
> equivalent of the CPython 2.3 itertools module. I.e
> groupby and tee
> are missing.
>

Yeah, I looked at it and didn't find a cure. :(  Im
down to 2 failures, one may be fixed by fixing another
module.  The other one appears to be testing for an
optimisation that reuses the same tuple if no one is
holding onto it.  Im not sure if there is a technical
answer in the JDK for that one, 5 introduced alot of
cool stuff but simple reference counts on an object
may not be one of them.

leouser


 
> 'Henke
>
>
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Re: Are you guys going to be interested in any jythonx stuff?

Samuele Pedroni-2
Leo User wrote:

> --- Henrik Eriksson <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>  
>> On 4/30/07, Leo User <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>    
>>> Ill have to check out your itertools
>>>      
>> implementation, there was one test case
>>    
>>> I couldn't pass... maybe you folks found a fix for
>>>      
>> it. :)
>>
>> Note that the itertools module for jython (2.3+)
>> only implements the
>> equivalent of the CPython 2.3 itertools module. I.e
>> groupby and tee
>> are missing.
>>
>>    
>
> Yeah, I looked at it and didn't find a cure. :(  Im
> down to 2 failures, one may be fixed by fixing another
> module.  The other one appears to be testing for an
> optimisation that reuses the same tuple if no one is
> holding onto it.  Im not sure if there is a technical
> answer in the JDK for that one, 5 introduced alot of
> cool stuff but simple reference counts on an object
> may not be one of them.
>  
that's testing an implementation detail of CPython.
It should be ignored by non refcounted implementations.




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